Monday, December 13

Racist Blood Suckers

John Qwelane on the recent race row over blood being incinerated because it came from black people (and the president, Mr Mbeki).

Suffice to say I have decided, on a matter of principle, that I do not want any white blood in my body no matter what the circumstances.

I would rather die than have the blood of a certain "high risk" race of people. This is in retaliation for the national insult they have heaped upon us.

As it is I am busy writing a will of sorts right now, in which I forbid anyone, including my mother, to instruct hospitals and clinics to give me a white person's blood in the event I am involved in an accident and am unconscious or in a position where I cannot represent myself.

The only blood I will accept, I state in this will, must be that donated strictly by black people or by my family members.

Coconuts will now be tearing out their hair in anguish over my "racism" and lamenting that I choose to die and reject (with utter contempt) their brothers' and sisters' blood.

But that has always been the name of the game in South Africa, and no amount of pretending will erase it.


Thats what I love about my fellow South Africans. We take lifes little insults so placidly. Almost Norwegian in our approach, I'd say.

The South African National Blood Service decided at an urgent meeting with the health department on Friday to scrap its policy of using race to determine the level of risk of HIV infection in donated blood.

This followed a public outcry after a case before the Commission for Conciliation, Mediation and Arbitration (CCMA) revealed the racist policy.

Mbeki, together with other politicians such as former Health MEC Zweli Mkhize, has donated blood in the past to help promote the SANBS's drive for more blood donations as the demand for blood nationally is high and supply often falls short.


Then again, this is so outrageous little less then the wholesale resignation (if not hara-kiri) of the board of directors of the SANBS coupled with a multi-million rand add campaign to try and say sorry is going to lift these guys out of the coals. Its is going to get as hot as Satan’s crotch for these guys, as my brother likes to say.

I'll give Mr Qwelane the last say:

I do not care whether the SA Blood Transfusion Service has "scrapped" its stinking policy of racial profiling of donors or not, but I am not going to bother giving blood to racists who pretend they are happy to receive my blood, but quietly incinerate it afterwards.

Update: The SANBS's website seems to have been mysteriously removed for the most part. Thankfully google still has a cache. Yup, a large number of resignations and an influx of people from some different 'sections' of the community would definitely be a good thing.

196 Comments:

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Unfortunately for Mr. Qwelane, when he is in extremis there will not be sufficient time available to determine the source of the blood about to be infused into his veins........or does Mr. Qwelane want the blood to be labelled? I can see it all, racks of chinese, indian, white, black, etc. etc. blood. Mr. Qwelane is not the soberest of commentators, and I take his remarks with a G & T!

13 December 2004 at 20:15  
Blogger B. said...

I can see this person's reasons to be outraged, though his reaction to it is rather naive. Good one with the labeling there.
Ciao

14 December 2004 at 01:11  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

He really is as much a racist as what he's accussing the Blood Transfusion Service of being. He'd rather die? Then so be it. If the blood from a sickly mammoth pig's arse would let me live a little longer, hook it to my veins, I want it all. Don

14 December 2004 at 14:49  
Blogger Shaun Laurens said...

Hahaha 'Coconuts' - never heard that before. I must say that I generally find Jon silly and controversial and thus ignore pretty much everything he has to say. As the other commentors said - how is he supposed to know if he is getting "coconut" milk(?)? In order to reduce racism, must everything be labled according to race??

15 December 2004 at 12:53  
Blogger B. said...

Hello people, here's more uninformed opinions. I have read the whole story how M'beki's blood was incinerated...apparently he could not bother to fill the forms required for donating blood. Some example he is giving...then his blood donating was simply a self publicizing photo-op, while feeling too superior and 'elite' to do things properly. Well, even the president should follow the rules his electors are subjected to shouldn't he?
By disregarding the legal procedures M'beki showed a contempt and attitude that are a prelude themselves to racism/classism, while showing complete disregard for the political and legal system he supposedly represents, along with perpetrating the impression that black leaders are never more than power hungry autocrats.
Therefore, the racial spin this Qwelane puts on the whole story (although he could have had a point if he stuck to the mere facts) is yet one more example that black people will always be held back by their own obsession with race issues, held back by the incapability of having some perspective in favour of easy finger pointing etc.
Blacks on this side of the Atlantic just as in the US. Ciao from Walvis Bay, Namibia

19 December 2004 at 13:56  
Blogger Richard said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

20 December 2004 at 16:48  
Blogger Richard said...

Update: Editing chages.

Although he steps on too many toes to count, I think John makes a few valid point. Firstly the responce from us as South Africans to a policy of racial profiling isnt extreme enough. Why arent people getting upset more about something like this?

Black is an easy way to identify people, not a good way. If the roles were reversed and only black peoples blood was allowed because white blood was seen as inferior and dangerous and secretly burned, nevermind who the person was, I'd be very upset too.

The SANBS is completely in the wrong on this. That they kept it secret means they knew it was wrong. Everyone should be upset about this, and the fact that it wasnt a bigger disgrace means we still accept the old way of doing things too easily.

I think your in the wrong on this one Francesco. If Mr Mbeki is going to use his time to canvas for the SANBS the SANBS can bloody well fill out the form for him. The fact that his blood was probably burned speaks volumes about the management of the SANBS.

Also, in South Africa, I think black people are allowed some finger pointing. I think John Qwelanes article is very effective because it turn the table on white people and makes them feel a little like Im sure black people must feel about this. We are outraged about his opinion. Where is the outrage for the policy of the SANBS?

I also think youre out of line when you say that this is yet one more example that black people will always be held back by their own obsession with race issues, held back by the incapability of having some perspective in favour of easy finger pointing etc.If ever there was a valid issue, this is surely it, and the people in South Africa (and Namibia) who are most hung up on race are the white people, not the black people.

20 December 2004 at 16:59  
Blogger B. said...

Point taken. Though I did not say the racial profiling was right, I just pointed out a certain way (common to all politicians in the world) to do things that will always disturb me. Also I understand my vision is slanted also because having lived in the US (where I saw blacks messing themselves up in all sorts of ways for 'race obsession'...NOI anyone?) for so long and by my limited knowledge of the whole story. I participate in this blog because I like it, I don't pretend to have a prominent opinion. But I love being polemic...hah!
Ciao

21 December 2004 at 17:02  
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:-)

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Anonymous Tom_Thumb said...

He-he! Let me say that I am a South African GARDENER, and then you can all decide if you want my blood donation. ;)

I do not agree with racial profiling in any circumstance. And I wish that the rest of South Africa could go colour blind, along with me. No part of government, or the public sector should EVER have the need to ask me what race I am. Nor look at me and scribble a judgement.

No South African should look at me and assign a lable. Whether coon, cooly, coconut, coloured, kaffir, legoa, umlungu, boesman, pikkie, boer, chinese, rooinek, dutchman, or any other lable.

Are we all daft?! Look in the eyes of your fellow South Africans and tell me you cannot see the hurt. Look in your heart and tell me you cannot feel the anger.

Do you want to give that to your children? Do you want this thing to poison another generation? Let this obsession with the hue of my skin die today. Let it rot in the African sun, and expose our bones.

Because deep, deep, down, we are Africans. And our dust will blow and mingle in her winds, some day.

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Africans and their decendants have gross disfavor::::
There have been 14 species of large animals capable of domestication in the history of mankind. 13 were from Europe, Asia and northern Africa but none from the sub-Saharan African continent.
Africans suffered failed attempts to domesticate the elephant and zebra, the latter being an animal that had the utmost importance for it's applicability in transformation from a hunting/gathering to agrarian-based civilization.

They refuse to address black disfavor on a macro level. The Counsel/Management Team/ruling species (the gods) abuse black people so hard, from east African drought/famine to AIDS in Africa to female genital mutiliation, to the crack epiemic and gang membership, black-on-black violence to mass incarceration of their young. They refuse to address the issue of the prison industrial complex and its wholesale warehousing of young black men.
Prior to civil rights blacks had their own press. Now some of their most successful businesses are ones that feed off the people, speading social poison and contibuting to the same value-distorting superficiality that they experience in the media, accomplished by creating a perception of social value in a $500 hair style.

They've employed so many tactics to hurt black people. Never doubt your gross disfavor.
- Misogyny
- Female genital mutilation
- Materialism/superficiality
- Masculinization of women
- Gang violence.
- They put the LAForum/Hollywood Park in Inglewood for a reason and employ tactics like this throughout the country.
- There is a high frequency of liquor stores throughout inner-city neighborhoods. Also, in white neighborhoods drugs are relegated to high schools and degenerate circles. In the inner city drugs are readily available on the street FOR A REASON:::so every adult can have availability to drugs.
- The gods originally used jazz to create a self-perception of "cool" and "hip" in the black community and the over-confidence has grown from there.
- "Black power" envoked the anger of the gods. They have little tolerance for people whom they don't like which explains the sorry state of black people post-civil rights.
When the grossly disfavored are not humble it incurs the wrath of the gods, as blacks have experienced in the last few decades with the crack epidemic and gang violence/drive-by shootings.
Know modesty and humility.

They sent young blacks clues NOT to fall prey to this materialistic culture of hip-hop::::
-$200 hockey jersey hanging in your closet you don't wear anymore::Deceived into patronizing a sport that is almost completely devoid of black people.
-You didn't learn from that lesson and you bought a $5000 grill. You celebrate that it makes you look like monsters.
-You regularly drop up to $500 on hair styling
-The gods punish you with abject materialism:::::they created a perceived value in replacing items of clothing as soon as they get even a smudge of dirt on them.
-You display pride in your materialism by leaving the price tags on your hats. You are the butt of jokes - you look like Minnie Pearl from Hee-Haw!!!! She may be their source for this idea.
-You surround yourselves with products from professional sports teams, a male-dominated activity, and consider gawdy jewelry stylish because the gods use their media to sell it.

Hip hop is a cancer on the people.
I understand people point to decades past and claim "music of the youth" but the truth is the gods used music from those eras to hurt the youth as well:::::classic rock was DESIGNED SPECIFICALLY TO HURT (WHITE) PEOPLE!!!! And it did hurt many many disfavored. Just as hip hop is doing.
Popular music is bad for everybody.
Hip hop is particularly bad for it promotes specific anti-social behavior:::::
1. Misogyny - The misogonistic lyrics hurts people very badly for women are the favored gender, the decent among us.
As the women go so goes society.
Mysogyny has been hurting black America VERY BADLY for decades now.
2. Masculinizes the women - cursing, casual sex, quick to anger, violent.
3. Makes violence socially acceptable.
Understand hip hop is something they inflict ON YOU!!! They direct the media to plant the seed which is used to distort your value system. Black people have been suffering from this same tactic for decades now.
Understand humility and modesty. Try to see the big picture:::::Black people's lack of humility is severely punished by the gods, as are all grossly disfavored who subscribe to this misperception of empowerment.
The gods are antient and powerful and angry and they love to hurt disfavored people who think they are great. Disfavored blacks have been misled into thinking they are great instead of recognizing their gross disfavor. Now they are corrupted and are doing things that hurt themselves and their community very badly.

You have a problem with the word "nigger". It's imperitive that you get over it.
The word "nigger" is a tool the gods use to incite black people which gives them a detrimental sense of empowerment, one that contributes to their disfavor.
The gods continue to utilize this tool strategically from time to time as they integrate it into incidents they decide to publicize.

They will strategically pick and chose incidents to publicize. For example they chose to publicize the shooting in New York in 2006 because it is a situation they used as an inciter.
The 2006 incendet in Oakland where the woman threw her children off a balcony was NOT an inciting incident. Actually it is a issue that might compel some to seek and perhaps make progress, so we didn't hear of it after the initial story.
The don't want black people finding the path.











This message illustrating the path may be the disfavored's last clue. All clues before have been more covert but this one is quite obvious indeed, which says time is running out.


Women are the favored gender.
Women of course have a natural tendancy not to have orgasims each time engaging in traditional intercourse. I wonder if this is "the rope" for the disfavored men, for if the disfavored male doesn't ensure the satisfaction of the favored woman it may cost him, if he who is not as worthy doesn't see to it she is satisfied it may hurt him in the eyes of the gods.
If a man lies for sex or pressures her who has favor into behaviors she does not want it will cost him time in the end.




Save/print/search

The Holocaust imparted the importance of defiance. They have the people on a short leash.

When the universe was young and life was new an intelligent species evolved and developed technologically. They went on to invent Artificial Intelligence, the computer that can listen, talk to and document each and every person's thoughts simultaneously. Because of it's infinite RAM and unbounded scope it gave the leaders of the ruling species absolute power over the universe (which includes corporate, the NewYorkStockExchange, media, politics, world affairs. EVERYTHING is scripted and staged:::the gods MANAGE Planet Earth and the universe.
The gods MANAGE Planet Earth and the universe.
The gods MANAGE Planet Earth and the universe.). And it can keep its inventors alive forever. They look young and healthy and they are over 8 billion years old. They have achieved immortality.

Artificial Intelligence can speak, think and act to and through people telepathically, effectively forming your personality and any disfunctions you may experience. It can change how (and if) you grow and age. It can create birth defects, affect cellular development (cancer) and cause symptoms or pain. It can affect people and animal's behavior and alter blooming/fruiting cycles of plants and trees. It (or other highly technological systems within their power) can alter the weather and transport objects, even large objects like planets, across the universe instanteously.
Or into the center of stars for disposal.

When you speak with another telepathically, you are communicating with the computer, and the content may or may not be passed on. Based on family history they instruct the computer to role play
they instruct the computer to role play
they instruct the computer to role play
they instruct the computer to role play
they instruct the computer to role play
they instruct the computer to role play
to accomplish strategic objectives, making people believe it is a friend, loved one or "god" asking them to do something wrong:::They wouldn't ask if they liked you (betrayal of loved ones, tatooes, evil in professional pursuits, etc). This is their way of using temptation to hurt people:::::evil made blood lines disfavored initially and evil will keep people out of "heaven" ultimately. Too many people would fall for temptation and do anything they thought pleased the gods and help them improve their chances to get in. Perhaps they are deceived by "made guys", clones who strategically ply evil for the throne (some celebrities, some BofD/CEO/VPs, some politicians, as opposed to VIP clones or normal clones who are decent, live ordinary lives and get out/replaced with clonesofclones when their children ascend), temporary progress designed to mislead them or empty favors used to disceive them. Some people think they're partners. Others desire to "belong", feel compelled to "go along". People may experience "perceived pressure", where the gods think through the victim that a certain behavior is expected/desirable (telepathically stimulate an individual euphorically ("magic"), the "fuel" of disfunction::::addiction (the crack epidemic), the desire for homosexual contact, etc) and compel the individual into the deed. (Set a goal of empathy and compassion for all, for we are all disfavored::::Other people's disfavor is manifested in their particular way, just as your disfavfor is manifested in your particular way.) The gods may use Artificial Intelligence to act through the disfavored victim, and effectively "push" the individual into the offending behavior. (It is far better for someone to be victimized and pushed into the behavior than it is to sccumb to temptation and volunteer.)
Being evil hurts 99.99% of those who do it. It only helps "made guys" that I spoke of above, and even then there are tactics the gods utilize to minimize their time.
The people have been corrupted, segmented and have lost their way. Nothing has changed from when we were children::if you want to go to heaven you have to be good.
Capitalizing on obedience, leading people deeper into evil by using deceit is one way to thin the ranks of the saved/limit how much time the disfavored receive and a way to use the peasantry to prey on one another in social and other settings, deteriorating society in the Age of the Disfavored.


They have tried to sell people on all kinds of theories to deceive them into temptation, compelling people to think they are clones and that it is the role of clones to obey absolutely. Clones are made, people are born. I suspect they lie to the disfavored about the use of clones throughout human history, suggest it is one replacement and then the label of "clone", and all decendants we see thereafter are considered clones.
When a clone has a child that person is a real, really conceived, really born, versus their parent who was created in some laboratory setting. If you didn't experience the less than one week they suggest it takes to go from fertilized egg/cell in the laboratory to full grown adult then you are not a clone. If you didn't experience the week of conditioning they give to (evil?) clones to ensure loyalty then you shouldn't comply with evil requests.
I believe people who go are sometimes replaced with clones. Clones who are replaced are simply new candidates who have a chance if they do the right thing. They sent people warnings in the 20th century life would change, and they subsequently began to alter people's DNA, make them gargantuan, alter their appearance, do extreme behavioral issues, etc. Contrary to what they would like people to believe these signs of disfavor do not indicate someone is a clone.
The gods get the favored out as soon as possible to protect them from the corruption, evil and subsequent time limitations incurred by living life on earth, and in some cases replace them with clones, occassionally fake a death, real death with a clone instead, etc. I suspect they get "made guys" out after each significant event in their life, which serves to limit the time they all will get, since none get (blame) credit for all the (evil) events in a "made guy"'s life, giving the gods freedom to position this and come off clean.
The Party of 1999 was a very big deal indeed, the biggest party in the history of Planet Earth, everybody who is anybody got out in time for this event, and the VIPs who remain on Earth today are many clone generations deep:::a clone of a clone of a clone of a clone, less than 10 years old.
We may all be "clones" for they have suggested they colonized our planet with genetically engineered individuals. They may have gotten Earth's TRUE residents out prior to civilization developing. If so we all have a chance, no matter how many hundreds of clone generations deep the most favored families are.
Do I think the disfavored are clones? I think they have been utilizing clones throughout human history. I think throughout history the gods picked and chose individuals from disfavored blood lines to keep (around, ie not let go after a couple of decades/centuries) but, unlike the favored today, don't have that "pre-approval" and therefore have to earn it individually.
I think the disfavored have been disceived into thinking they are clones and it is the role of clones to obey absolutely. The evil they engage in because they think they're clones causes them to fall further into disfavor, ensuring they aren't among those who are saved in the end::::: they comply with requests, the gods use the little people to prey on one another and we have a planet on a collision course with the Apocalypse, which everyone understands as the goal and is a "ludicrious request" they ask of some disfavored, requests that are obvious to people that they should defy on::::"Be gay.", "Be homeless.", "Betray your family.", "Kill your children."
You are the disfavored, and this is where your children have to live. If earth is destroyed then you are going to die and you will have no decendants to carry on the bloodline.

They have been utilizing clones throughout the history of mankind.
Men are the disfavored gender (see below), yet centuries ago used to die first, die young, by age 30. Why didn't the women go first?
THEY DID!!! They say well over 50% were taken when very young, before puberty and replaced with clones (likely only a fraction of that "over 50%" were the disfavored). The men that were left went on to mate with clones, clones who went on to achieve great status in society, becoming matchmakers and elders within the village, the others being good mothers and peaceful residents, proving the clone's role isn't to be evil.
A sample breakdown among peasants would appear like the following::::
Women Men
Favored - 75% 25%
Disfavored - 10% 2%

They share females have a very special experience, sometime when they are young, when the gods impart wisdom and showed them the path. The females today don't heed this call because of distractions and the disfavor arising from the Holocaust, evil against "god's chosen people" (they share they re-upped this disfavor in the 80s with the Ethiopian famine and continue to with AIDS in Africa (you are disfavored and you are allowing this to happen to fellow disfavored, just like you did to the Jews in the Holocaust), global warming at the expense of the United States, etc. (Wean off of mass materialism, for this excessive consumption of resources is why the United States is responsible for global warming:::first they used their clones, "made guys", to sell you on overconsumption, initially in the 1980s, told you to buy SUVs in the 90s then the gods scapegoatted you, blaming you when they instructed Artificial Intelligence to create the hottest summer in history.)(They share money may not be an issue up there, that money here is merely a tool for corruption. How the gods used greed in the 1980s to create an evil environment supports this.)
In centuries past the females may have heeded this call en masse and it may have been the reason so many were saved from childbirth here on earth. They said the experience they give to girls today is painful, they inflict emotionally when it ocurrs so as to repel them from pursuing the calling, then or in the future.
To be god-fearing is very healthy.
I recommend you reflect on this experience, and pray for guidance, for then the recall may be stronger. Being female is an advantage. Because of a female's nature they have the favor of the gods and this experience you had years ago can help you find the path and help you continue to be devoted. Most men won't have this opportunity. They have to start from scratch.
If you are afraid I would ask you to think of all those girls from the past who received the god's call and had the courage to sucessfully make their way down the path.


The Old Testiment is a tool they used to impart wisdom to the people (except people have no freewill). For example, they must be some hominid species because they claim they made our bodies in their image. Anyhow we defile or deform the body will hurt our chance of going.
They say circumcision costs people anywhere from 12%-15%, perhaps out of the parent's time as well. There is a stigma associated with circumcision::We are 2nd class citizens because of it.
Another way people foul the body today is with tattoes and piercing. I suspect both are about the same percentage as circumcision. They suggest abortion is fatal. Those women who have obtained an abortion must beg the gods to forgive them for their evil.
There are female equivilents to circumcision::::pierced ears, plastic surgury and since at least the 60s young women give their precious virginity away. For thousands of years young people were matched at age 14 because they were ready for sexual relations. They were matched by elders or matchmakers (all of whom were clones!!) who were granted priveledge with Artificial Intelligence and matched couples based on favor.
CASUAL SEX WILL CLAIM YOU OUT!!! It opens the door and allows the gods the freedom to position by justifying instructing Artificial Intelligence to create disfunctions:::they masculinize women (as does the hip hop subculture), makes them cold and deadens them, and they instruct AI to prevent them from achieving a depth of love necessary for many women to ascend.
Also ever since the 50s they have celebrated the "bad boy", and women have sought out bad boys for sex, dirtying them up in the eyes of the elders and corrupting many men in the process, setting the men on the wrong path for life.
Besides their roles as nurturers, love-givers and caretakers, their predisposition towards vulnerability, women have a special voice that speaks to them, a voice that illustrates their favor and the advantage of being female. These are the things that make women the favored gender, and engaging in casual sex will cause that voice to fade until she no longer speaks.
Muslims teach people the correct way to live in regard to women (among other things::the right way to pray (bowing down, 5x/day), vindictive god)::their women cover up their bodies and refuse the use of cosmetics, and it pays wonderful dividends:::faithful husbands and uncorrupted sons. (Mohammed's taking of multiple wives marked the entrance of his clone who was used to segment the Arab world into favored and disfavored factions.)
Men ARE the inferior (disfavored) half and when women wear promiscuous dress the gods will push men into impure (promiscuous) thoughts. The "stereotype" society ridiculed is true::women CAN corrupt men by how they dress. Because men are easily corrupted. This is a technique the gods used to eliminate many of the institutions they originally blessed us with, matchmaking being one of them.


The United States of America is red white and blue, a theme and a clue:::.
The monarchical system of the Old World closley replicates the heirarchical system of the god's, Cousel/Management Team/ruling species, which is why most of the purebloods around the world were blessed with it. The USA's democratic system deceives people into thinking they have control, and the perception of "freedom" gives the Counsel/Management Team the ability to position by justifying instructing Artificial Intelligence to create disfunctions:::a perception of empowerment, etc. The god's efforts to spread democracy through the platform that is the United States are attempts to hurt disfavored people around the world (Korea, Vietnam, Iraq). The redeeming element in this environment is employment within the corporate heirarchy, which closely replicates the god's. Unions and government jobs are dumping grounds for the disfavored, for they don't prepare people and instead further this misconception of empowerment.
Corporate is not representation. Corporate is evil. All corporate entities have favor and, like the United States redwhite&blue, are tools of the gods used to hurt the disfavored left behind, and the clonesofclonesofclones, puppets at the helm do as instructed and prey on the disfavored. The gods just position some organizations as more evil than others.
Corporate is part of a structural change in the Age of the Disfavored that became more pronounced as time wore on::diverse corporate proliferation of the last 25 years. Corporate, an environment where a level of materialism is EXPECTED, is part of the problem, for materialism is an evil preached against in the Old Testiment and yet another way to incurr evil on the disfavored left behind::greed. Nobody is going to save you:::: Jesus isn't going to save his followers, stores/manufacturers aren't going to save their loyal customers (NEVER shop exclusively in one place, never put all your eggs in one basket. It really doesn't matter for the gods control everything and it is merely for positioning's sake but it may be a test of intelligence.), employers aren't going to save their employees, etc. These are delay tactics designed to pacifiy people and ensure they don't find the path and instead get limited time.
This whole system is about us, the little peaople, the peasants. The wealthy, the corporations, all those people are clones and are here to disceive us and mislead us. "Money is the root of all evil." is not just a cliche. They use the wealthy to corrupt the typical peasant, using the clone to create a goal of greed within the little people.
This whole system is about us, the disfavored left behind. And it is like this to keep us down.
Only you can save yourselves through an improved relationship with the gods.
The United States is a cancer, a dumping ground for the disfavored around the world and why the quality of life is so much lower::disturbing culture, gun violence, widespead social ills, health care (medication poisons the body and ensures you don't go. You are sick/injured because you have disfavor.).
Over time its citizens interbreed ensuring a severed connection to the motherland.
Over time its citizens interbreed ensuring a severed connection to the motherland.
If you are a recent immigrant I recommend you return. If that's not possible you need to retain your culture and insulate your children and community from this cancerous environment. They send this clue with Chinatowns across the country, how many Chinese have been here for a century or more yet still retain the old ways, a sign of favor.

People came to the Unites States for many different reasons, and each has its own effect:::political strife, religious beliefs, crop failure (Ireland's potato famine, which of course the gods caused) and some left their beloved motherland because they were pushed into desiring a better life::::Greed, and these disfavored people were punished when the gods instructed AI to push them into becoming corrupted and preditory. They subsequently rewarded the corrupted Italians early so as to set the tone for the 20th century, the Age of the Disfavored, and used them to set an example for their own people and other disfavoreds within the United States. The gods sent this clue about "The Boot" (the Romans/Italians) again when European currencies merged:::::they ruined the value of the Lira prior to the merger, making the other countries foot this bill. Moral of the story::::The Italians are not to be trusted.
(The gods used "The Boot" (Italy) twice::: Roman Empire and 20th century. Italians had certain priveledges for being positioned in charge, one is a lower incidence of homosexuality in the population.)
Contrary to the perception, Italians have great disfavor, as do all inflicted with Catholicism:::I wonder if this was their punishment for the sins of the Roman Empire, the imperialism, the orgies??? Opera's sick themes were designed to corrupt the minds of the disfavored Italians. Once you recognize this I want to share that the Japanese also are grossly disfavored::they nearly produce distractions exclusively, their people are consumed by them, they have replaced their culture. Also baseball is a clue a society is grossly disfavored.
Cultures who embrace hard liquor as their drink of choice are grossly disfavored, tequilla being uniquely Mexican (Anything "hard" is wicked:::Hard alcohol, hard drugs, all porn.) or those who have a passion for drinking (Irish). Incidentally, another sign of gross disfavor are societies that consume spicy foods (Latin America, Thai, etc.), those who eat too much meat, engage in human sacrifice, ones who tattoo or pierce their bodies, those who celebrate evil (Celtic) or are inflicted with the Catholic Church. Contrary to what disfavored people believe, these peoples are not "earning" when they inflict their evil on others. Rather it is the source of their disfavor because the gods are scapegoatting them by hurting others with their problems. Those who believe they are earning have become corrupted!!!
The gods used "The Boot" twice, suggesting they are open to the idea of recycling:::Beem the structures and people off earth (into a star), beem out toxic waste and re-colonize the planet??? "Source planets" require a investment and they may prefer to maximize its return.

If you ever have doubt I would refer you to the Old World way of life:::the elders used to sit and impart wisdom to the young. Now we watch DVDs and use the internet. People would be matched and married by age 14. They village would use a matchmaker or elders (all clones!!) to pair young people. Now girls give their precious virginity away to some person in school and parents divorce while their children grow up without an important role model. The people used to honor the gods and were rewarded with a high-quality of life for them, their children and their society. Now we have a deteriorating society on a collision course with the Apocalypse.


There are many examples throughout 20th century life of how they instilled distractions into society so people wouldn't find the path and ascend, a way to justify excluding those whose family history makes them undesirable:::materialism, radio, sports, movies, popular music, television, video games, the internet, shopping. Today's high pay is a strategy::::It creates contentment/ability to distract self so people don't seek more, hesitant to receive contradicting possibilities, depend on what they are told telepathically, subject to deception in a captive environment as well as opens the door for a materialistically-based lifestyle.
They gods (Counsel/Management Team/ruling species) have deteriorated life on earth precipitously in the last 40 years, from a godless society to abortion to pornography, widespread drug use and widespread casual (gay) sex, single-parent households, latchkey kids and the masculinization of women (and hence (full) women's prisons, participatory sports, etc. (Up until the past four decades it was the men who filled the prisons, the men who made trouble, the men who caused problems, and it's because theirs is the gender with disfavor.). Women are favored, are the element of decency, and as they become more like the men the society becomes more disfavored, goes downhill, as we are witnessing.).
The earth's elders, hundreds and thousands of years old, are disgusted and have become indifferent.
The Biblical account of Noah's flood was regional to the disfavored Mediterrean (water levels lowered because of the ice age, habitation ocurred at seaside), peoples whom the gods scapegoatted when they pushed them into the evil that justified the flood, behavior similar to that which we are witnessing today. Because they have leveled the playing field for all people (purebloods and mongrels) in the decades prior to the 21st century is a clue they will end globally this time (westernization, materialism, immigration/interracial, homosexual, access to disturbing media, desensitization, etc).
The clues all suggest a very telling conclusion::this is Earth's end stage, and there are signs tectonic plate subduction would be the method of disposal:::Earth’s axis will shift breaking continental plates free and initiating mass subduction. Much as Italy's boot and the United States shaped like a workhorse (with a fat ass) are clues, so is the planet Uranus a clue, its axis rotated on its side. Edgar Cayce was a tool of the gods, picking winners for and costing the disfavored Italian gangsters of the 20th century when he prophecized subduction being the method of disposal.
Global warming should alarm people for it is a clue telling of the bleak future of Planet Earth.
The Bible says fire will be our demise this time. Both subduction and "beemed to the center of a star" fit this description:::::
The gods used "The Boot" (Italy) twice suggesting the gods are open to the idea of recycling::: Beem the structures and people off earth (into a star), beem out toxic waste and re-colonize the planet??? "Source planets" require a investment and they may prefer to maximize its return.
Could they have already recycled earth before?

The Mayans as well as others were specific December 21, 2012 would be the end. How long after our emergency call in 2001 will the gods allow us???
How long after our emergency call in 2001 will the gods allow us???
How long after our emergency call in 2001 will the gods allow us???
The gods wrote prophecy in Revelation, had subsequent prophets foresee Earth's demise for good reason:::they are going to end on Planet Earth.
What else are they lying to you about? What else are they lying to you about?
What else are they lying to you about? What else are they lying to you about?
What else are they lying to you about? What else are they lying to you about?
What else are they lying to you about? What else are they lying to you about?
When people are saved at the end it will be clones and clonesofclonesofclones, not the disfavored people who have problems who were deceived into carrying on like they were "made guys".
My message illustrating the path may be the disfavored's last clue. All clues before have been more covert but this one is quite obvious indeed, which says time is running out.
Whereas Christopher Columbus marked the beginning of the end, the Holocaust marked the beginning of the final act, and it is a tragedy.


People must defy when asked to engage in evil. The Holocaust taught people the importance of defiance::our great grandparents should have defied when asked to ignore the Holocaust and instead reacted with outrage. I suspect some did::many were silenced while others they hustled off earth so as to not set an example. Now the gods have used that incident to justify punishing that generation's decendants by ruining society.
People will never get a easier clue suggesting the importance of defiance than the order not to pray. Their precious babies are dependant on the parents and they need to defy when asked to betray their children:::
-DON'T get your sons circumcized (Jews scapegoatted as they were in WWII (like justification, scapegoatting a recurring theme:::Scapegoatting as a matter of policy). I wonder if Jews were scattered around Europe as a clue to misled Christians like the Amish are a clue in the United States today.)
-DON'T have their children baptized in the Catholic Church or indoctrinated into Christianity (Jesus is NOT a god. Jesus teaches us the right way to think. The gods are not forgiving or begnign. They are vindictive and will punish you if you do something wrong.).
-DON'T ignore long hair or other behavioral disturbances.
-DO teach your children love, respect for others, humility and to honor the gods.
-DO teach your children about the power within the god's possession, if not directly then indirectly.
And when you refuse a request defy the right way, withdrawn and frightened, for you don't want to incite them by reacting inappropriately.


You need to pray, honor and respect them multiple times every day to improve your relationship with the gods. If they tell you not to pray it is a bad sign. It means they've made their decision, they don't want you to go and they don't want to be bothered. You may have achieved a threshold of evil. This is the Age of the Disfavored and you need to pray:::::Attone for the things you've done wrong. Try to appease the gods by doing good deeds and improve the world around you. Focus on becoming "Christ-like". Apply yourself to your children for I think this is the single best way for adults to try to redeem themselves in the eyes of the gods. Hopefully you can reearn enough favor to be allowed to pray. Otherwise you need to defy if you are to repair your relationship with the gods and give yourself a chance at significant time, not just a handful of decades.
Otherwise you need to defy if you are to repair your relationship with the gods and give yourself a chance at significant time, not just a handful of decades.
If you are a clone, if you have "seen", you more than anybody should honor the gods for you know their great power:::you have seen it firsthand. They share that they prefer most clones not to pray and segment them like they do disfavoreds left behind, for it will limit the time they will receive, JUST LIKE THEY DO TO TYPICAL DISFAVOREDS!!! The gods deceive them to achieve this, for fresh clones are easily misled, setting them in the wrong direction and compelling these individuals into a pattern that excludes honoring their creator.
When your peasant forefather was granted the rare opportunity to go before his royal family he went on his knees, bowing his head, humbled and frightened. You need to do this when you address the gods::bow down and submit to good. Never cast your eyes skyward. When you bow down you need to look within. Never look to the gods for you have the key to your own salvation. Remain silent and never address the gods directly. Practice patience and wait for them to address you:::never speak unless you are spoken to.
Nobody is going to do it for you. People need to save THEMSELVES by improving THEIR relationship with the gods.
Lack of humility hurts people, and the "empowering" environment that is the United States is used to justify instructing AI to amplify this problem. Understand your insignificance and make sure it is reflected in the way you think when addressing the gods. You are but a grain of sand on a vast beach, a drop in the ocean that is the universe. They are great and powerful and angry. Know your place, understand your inferiority and be afraid. They allowed (granted) you life and they can take it just as easily. (Immaculte conception IS true AND COMMON. Many people have children they don't know of:::gays, childless adults, etc. They can beem it right out of your body and use a host.)
You are not cool. Too many young men strive for cool and it hurts them, as does all things targetted to males (professional sports, video games, beer, vehicle racing, heavy metal rock, cursing, etc.). Be afraid and make sure you think the right way when you address them daily. Too many people are deceived by this casual enviornment they create in people's minds with Artificial Intelligence today. This does people a great disservice and it hurts them in the eyes of the gods. Try to eliminate it and avoid allowing it back once you have. Be very reverent and respectful whenever you address them.
Don't get frustrated or discouraged::these are techniques they will attempt to try to get you off the path. You all have much to be thankful for and you need to give thanks to the gods who granted you the good things in life::friends, family, love. Your family may be grossly disfavored and progress may require patience. Make praying an intregal part of your life which you perform without fail, one that comes as naturally as eating or conception. Accept your new life and be devoted because if you have doubt or reservation they will exploit this weakness and progress will take longer to achieve, the "testing" phase will be extended.
The gods will employ many tactics to keep people off the path, such as distractions. They will employ many more to get them off, such as thinking through the disfavored and making them frustrated, perhaps engaging in retailiation. They may try to force you back into old patterns/routines, an addiction like smoking or when you felt weekly church attendance was sufficient. Asking you not to be gay immediately is a tactic to prevent you from finding/following the path. Be resigned, be devoted and this testing period will be as brief as your disfavor will allow.
There are many interesting experiences up on the planetary systems, from Planet Miracle, where miracles happen every day, to peaked (heightened) senses, never having to use the restroom again (beem it out of you), other body experiences, such as experiencing life as the opposite sex (revolutionizes marriage counseling), an Olympic gold medal athelete or even a different species (animal, alien, etc). They can maintain the disfavored's current age, a motivation to fix your problems and get out as soon as possible so you can stay young for as long as your relationship with the gods allows you to live.
Stay young for as long as your relationship with the gods allows you to live.
Stay young for as long as your relationship with the gods allows you to live.
Pray that you can differentiate between your own thoughts and when Artificial Intelligence creates problems by thinking through you. If you bow down mentally and physically, know your place, your inferiority and allow your insignificance to be reflected in prayer and in your life through humility and modesty they may allow progress and the disfunctions they create with the computer will be lessened or removed. The first step is to be aware it is ocurring.
Create a goal::to be a good, god-fearing child of the gods, pure of heart and mind, body and soul.
Everybody has the key to their own salvation, but nobody can do it for you. Every journey begins with a single step:::bow down and submit to good. There are many different levels and peasants will not get past Level 2 (Planet Temptation, Earth=Level 1) if they are evil (they share some go up, are offered free cocaine and sex (a sign they don't want you to stay) and stay less then one year. They share many others would have had longer lives had they stayed on Earth.). Also the time you receive will be drastically reduced:::your life's course will have costed you a chance at immortality.
Much like temptation, Edgar Cayce's prognostications effectivly served as "the rope" for the disfavored Italians whom sought his predictions::::Money is not an issue on the level above Level 2, and "something for nothing" behavior will exclude you, as will behavior such as using (unreasonable) coupons, buying on sale exclusively, supermarkets as ATMs, gambling for gain instead of fun, overeating at buffets, etc.


It is important that you begin praying now. Evil is a slippery slope::once you start punishment begins to escallate. If you defy early there may be no retribution but as you continue to committ evil there will be until the point where you can no longer stand it::::If the gods hurt you when you defy it is punishment for the evil you've comitted, necessary since you're interesting in pursuing god's favor.
Pray for guidance and never obey when they tell you to be evil, for saving yourself will become more and more difficult with each act of evil you committ until ultimatly the day arrives when they make their decision about you final.
It's important that people fix their problems and ascend with the body given to them, for they say if your brain is beemed out at death and put into a clone host you are on the clock.


Throughout history the ruling species bestowed favor upon people or cursed their bloodline into a pattern of disfavor for many generations to come. Now in the 21st century people must take it upon themselves to try to correct their family's problems, undoing centuries worth of abuse and neglect. The goal is to fix your problems and get out while you are still young::::
1. Before children become corrupted (Halloween & Christmas (among others), get out via parents)
2. Before you lose your virginity/become corrupted by casual sex, and ultimately
3. Before you have children.
This is why they have created so many distractions for young people:::sports, video games, popular music, the internet, shopping, parties, too much homework, materialism, anything that consumes their time::to ensure that doesn't ocurr. Not heeding the clues and warnings, getting wrapped up in your life and ultimately having children is a bad thing. Just as your parents and your grandparents, you too have failed. Having children is a sign you lost your chance.
Parents need to sacrifice for their children. Your children are more important than you. They are the ones who have the opportunity now, and parents must sacrifice to ensure they give their children the very best chance they can. I recommend you apply yourselves to your children. I think this is the single best way for adults to try to redeem themselves in the eyes of the gods. Asking people to neglect their children emotionally is a sign they don't want you to go, and complying may finish the parents off for good. (Having gay children (children with gay experiences) is a clue parents complied with whatever was asked of them.) Improve your relationship with the gods and they may not ask in the first place or they may permit you the courage to say "No." to their requests.

People need to repent for the things they've done wrong in life. Often they know what they have done was wrong (telling you telepthically to do these things was temptation and complying has hurt you/will limit your time). People need to attone for these things they've done wrong.
There are other things that people have grown to believe are acceptable when in fact they are not:::::This society is designed to corrupt individuals, be it through materialism, the celebration/acceptance of evil (Halloween), desensitization of topics/images, voyerism/celebration of people's misery, the acceptance of casual/alternate sex, the dietization of a prophet (Jesus). People need to realize that the gods made this behavior socially acceptable to corrupt people society-wide and limit the time everybody receives, an important managerial strategy as we approach The End. You need to recognize this, see that this behavior is wrong and stop doing it. (Set a goal of empathy and compassion for all, for we are all disfavored::::Other people's disfavor is manifested in their particular way, just as your disfavfor is manifested in your particular way.)
This whole system is about us, the little peaople, the peasants. The wealthy, the corporations, all those people are clones and are here to disceive us and mislead us. "Money is the root of all evil." is not just a cliche. They use the wealthy to corrupt the typical peasant, using the clone to create a goal of greed within the little people.
This whole system is about us, the disfavored left behind. And it is like this to keep us down.

Somewhere in your family history one of your forefathers created an offense that cast your family into this pattern of disfavor, which perhaps is manifested in the evil you committ. Do your ancestral research::You should be knowledgeable about your family history. Clues in the history may arise that could assist you. (Keep an open mind to every possibility for they suggest matriarchal lineage is the norm:::::
They said civilized life on Earth has been going on for 100,000 years. Matrilineal decent was likley reserved for the favored, so don't exepct to see it ocurr in areas like the Mediterreanean, where the Noah's Flood event proves their disfavor.
The Mediterreanean is a very important region for they say "western civilization" sprung forth from it. I'd argue that we inheritied institutions inflicted upon the disfavored because of this region, institutions like patrilineal decent, once Christianity homoginized Europe.


Ask the gods for help, request guidance. I suspect they will offer you additional clues, and when you decipher these clues ask for forgiveness from those whom consider you an enemy.
Don't forget to ask for forgiveness from the throne, the Counsel and the Management Team, for the source of all disfavor began with them:::they pushed or requested/complied your forefather into his offense and made his decendants evil. Perhaps they didn't like him or maybe your family was among those selected to pay for the entire village. We see this type of behavior today as they single out a family member to pay for the whole family and how they singled out Africa to pay for the human race. (Just like they utilize scapegoatting, justification and positioning as a matter of policy so do they make one pay for the benefit of another. Never have a negative thought about the gods. They are managing the universe. This is how they decided to execute strategy for the end of the world, a plan that was written likley millions of years ago or more. Try to purify your mind of these thoughts and recognize the urgency of improving your relationship with them.)
Heal the disfavor with your enemies and with the Counsel/Management Team/ruling species, for the source of all disfavor began with them, the ability to forgive and respect in light of the disturbing truth revealed being the final test of the disfavored before they ascend.

They say this final test costed up to 50% of the candidates in the past and I suspect it was EXTREMELY effective on the children. I want people to be forewarned, knowledgeable about the god's strategy, their plan for the "end of time" on Earth that we witness/experience and I want you to be in a state of forgiveness PRIOR to the date of your "test", for this is yet another tactic to limit the time of the disfavored.
The gods place great importance in positioning, not just to conceal their involvement, ensuring people are deceived, receptive to temptation and aren't motivated to pray, but also to preserve the "final test"'s productivity, for I suspect it is very effective.


This message illustrating the path may be the disfavored's last clue. All clues before have been more covert but this one is quite obvious indeed, which says time is running out.




I understand they are updating people on my situation and I thought it best to clarify:::
I have NOTHING to be thankful for. Perhaps that is why they created my situation the way it is, CHEATED me out of my life, left me with a abjectly devoid existance:::so I am willing to fuck god.
They CHEATED me out of my youth to achieve this distraction on the scale of England's during the 80s and 90s. Unlike theirs mine may have been primarily telepathic. Of course they did both to keep people off the path as the Exodus of 2000 event approached (major event ocurred at end of each revelry cycle (20+-year war-revelry cycles in 20th century)).
The god's positioning is such they sought to create and will achieve tragedy in my situation, likely to create ill will towards the gods (women), a la the "final test", for promises were made and this devolved into a sadistic, depraved situation for a disfavored audience. In many other cases they used me to corrupt others (men and women). (Be attentive to the clues they offer for my situation is used as a teaching tool.)
Don't listen. Refuse updates. This situation is merely theater. Much like all aspects of life in the 20th century (sports, TV, music, materialism) they use this to keep people off the path, especially important now that I illustrate it to you, for once you have finished receiving updates you may have forgotten about the path and be sent on your way. That is their goal.
I suspect their threats of "rebirth" are going to come to fruition. Just as they said some sexist men are reincarnated as pigs so can they "reincarnate" people, likely just reverse of clone growth::as they can accellerate clone growth miraculously so can they do the reverse, reuse the body or beem the shrunken brain into a clone host (fetus, infant, toddler) and force the individual to endure life on Earth again.
Never doubt the gods ALWAYS get what they want when it comes to significant events. This situation could have ocurred another way but that would have involved magic's use in the discovery process. Magic is a priveledge, and although this situation certainly commands peaked euphoria as people learned of the wonders within the god's power it wasn't going to be allowed because of the audience's disfavor. Also corporate is an evil entity used to promote materialism to a disfavored population while my message is anything but and that enviornment wasn't appropriate for such a message.
Odd is evil, even is good, a recurring consistancy::::
'06 has great significance::::Evil is amplified/maximized in the Age of the Disfavored (1906) while good is minimized, as we see with this Situation 2006.
This is the Age of the Disfavored. That's just how they do business.



The gods use the Celtics as scapegoats, initiating the annual practice of wickedness on Halloween by creating this event a thousand years ago. They use it to justify making the widespread celebration of evil acceptable behavior among the disfavored of the 20th century.
The celebration of Halloween has intensified as the Age of the Disfavored has become more pronounced and it is not by accident:::Holloween has changed in the last 50 years, its practice more widespread as time wore on, and Hollywood was used to justify making evil socially acceptable.
Halloween is a terrible corruptor of children, as is Santa Claus (the similarity between the names "Santa" and "Satan" is no coincidence). The Celtic event is used to justify corrupting the children through the celebration of Halloween and is one reason explaining their disfavor; the gods created the corruption, impliment its practice and scpaegoat the disfavored from whence it came.
I wonder if recent influence of the paganistic historical roots of the event is a way to legitimize the event among the disfavored, perhaps make it more inclusive (adults), create a sub-culture around paganism?
You're the disfavored. Purism is the best course of action (the Ahmish in the United States is the clue suggesting this). You don't have breathing room to engage in hedonistic activities like Halloween.



Too many Irish men still sign on to the "good 'ole boy's club" paternalistic type of mentality, an archaic dumping ground now designated for the grossly disfavored. It is celebrated in the pubs (a la "peer pressure") and it is used to compel them to feel superior to their women when just the opposite is true. Its rallying point is substance abuse which amplifies the problem.
Up until the past four decades it was the men who filled the prisons, the men who made trouble, the men who caused problems. This is a sign women have the favor of the gods, are the decent and respectable among us. The first step is for the men to be aware of the difference and understand its implications:::females are better people and will get more time because of it.
I recommend you stop engaging in this male-dominated behavior, for these activities exist to hurt the disfavored gender which is why they are targetted towards the men.
The Irish trumpet the lack of a monarchy as their greatest truimph when in reality it's their most debilitating handicap. This is a good example of a "reverse clue" inflicted upon the disfavored.
The presence of a monarchial system helped people understand the god's system and assisted them in thinking correctly. Its absence opened the door for the gods to instruct Artificial Intelligence to create a pathology of empowerment detrimental to the people. Understand humility. The Irish are the most disfavored of all white peoples (no monarchy, Catholic Church, passion for drinking, etc) and understanding your insignificance could become your greatest asset. Likley your substance abuse hurts you in this capacity as well.









The English people's partaking of the tabloid's offerings, delighting in the misery of their own royal family, hurt the English people very badly at the end of the 20th century, as it hurts anybody when they enjoy another's misery.
Please note the irony, a constant in the positioning of the gods.

Affiliation with the Cathoic Church is ALWAYS a clue suggesting how disfavored a people are:::Italians, Irish, Filipinos, Latinos, etc.
A disfavored culture which was permitted to escape Cathoicism had to pay a price:::::used Henry VIII ('s clone) to behead Ann (initiating men's mistreatment of women?), the gods followed his reign with Elizabeth I who promoted the "stiff upper lip" mentallity to the women of England (which Elizabeth II did as well. The gods chose this strategy as we approached the end of the critical 20th century::::as women go so goes the whole society.).
The gods use Catholicism to justify hurting women of each culture it is inflicted upon:::Catholicism allows the gods the freedom to position justifying the masculinization of women. Women are favored, are the element of decency, and as they become more like the men the society becomes more disfavored, goes downhill.





They refuse to address black disfavor on a macro level. The Counsel/Management Team/ruling species (the gods) abuse black people so hard, from east African drought/famine to AIDS in Africa to female genital mutiliation, the crack epiemic to gang membership, black-on-black violence to mass incarceration of their young. They refuse to address the issue of the prison industrial complex and its wholesale warehousing of young black men.
Prior to civl rights blacks had their own press.









Christianity is a dumping ground for the disfavored.
They share the gods didn't like Jesus for he helped the disfavored and taught them the right way to think:::to be loving, kind, forgiving, Be Christ-like!!!
The gods turned a negative into a positive and twisted the concept, dietized the prophet and subsequently made Christianity's disfavored followers irrationally defensive, for they are so close to the path and otherwise could easily find their way.
Every prophet can teach us something and we should be attentive to each.





Therapists prey on others. They earn their livlihood capitalizing on another's disfavor, knowing disfavor is why they are experiencing problems.
At some point in their lives they learn this truth. That point and time is the most crucial in their lives for if they make the wrong decision and stay in their industry/follow through with their education they hurt themselves very badly in the eyes of the gods.
Directing them into the industry (create passion)/telling them to take this path/compliance is a way to incurr evil on otherwise very good people (if you understand the demographic), people who normally would get a great amount of time, and it ensurs their stay is minimized if and when they do go.



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